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proveg said:
Thats a good question, if YES, i have a feeling there might be a significant price increase.
That my not be a good idea for BMW. 5-series aren't setting any sales records, and a price increase isn't a good idea for what are underpowered cars in their price range.

I want to get a new 530 for my business car, but I can't see myself paying $45K large for a 225 hp car! The Chrysler 300C I just test drove comes with some Benz bits, and has a serious 345 hp V8 and street cred, not to mention a meager $35K price tag. I need to spend $58K just to get a 545I that's comparable to the 300C.

I want to stay with BMW, but hard when there are so many new cars out there that offer more for less, sometimes much less. I understand and appreciate the BMW quality and feel, but it's getting harder and harder to justifying paying the higher price tag, especially when it's $23,000 more! For that extra cash, I can buy a 300C and a new Ford F150.

When escrow closes in my next 2 home sales, I’ll have the extra cash for the new 5-series or 300C, but I still haven’t decided yet. Hopefully those more powerful engines from BMW and NO price increase will sway my decision?
 

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oh u bet they will, i heard from more than one salesperson the 2006 model which starts production at end of 2005 will have the same new engines as the e90 3 series.
 

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120yz said:
Will the 530i and 525i change their engines to the new one like 2006 3-series?
Yes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
yeah... coz like right now.. 225hp for a big body like that wouldn't be enough..

about the price... you should not compare it with chrysler, but compare it with E500 or E320 which has similar price and quality and class...
 

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SD 328I said:
That my not be a good idea for BMW. 5-series aren't setting any sales records, and a price increase isn't a good idea for what are underpowered cars in their price range.

I want to get a new 530 for my business car, but I can't see myself paying $45K large for a 225 hp car! The Chrysler 300C I just test drove comes with some Benz bits, and has a serious 345 hp V8 and street cred, not to mention a meager $35K price tag. I need to spend $58K just to get a 545I that's comparable to the 300C.

I want to stay with BMW, but hard when there are so many new cars out there that offer more for less, sometimes much less. I understand and appreciate the BMW quality and feel, but it's getting harder and harder to justifying paying the higher price tag, especially when it's $23,000 more! For that extra cash, I can buy a 300C and a new Ford F150.

When escrow closes in my next 2 home sales, I’ll have the extra cash for the new 5-series or 300C, but I still haven’t decided yet. Hopefully those more powerful engines from BMW and NO price increase will sway my decision?
More for less eh?

If you want to quote advertised numbers, maybe so. But explain to me why the 330ci held its own against a 260 HP Infinity -- that's a 35 HP disadvantage. In fact, 0-60 the lower rated BMW was faster. I don't think that Chrysler will even come close to a 545 when you consider all the different parameters.

If advertised numbers blow your dress up, then you are right. But, I think for most of us, it takes more than factory advertised numbers to make an exceptional all around car. If you are into stop light wars or sitting around the bar bragging about how many ponies you have under your hood, then the Chrysler may be for you. Horsepower alone does not make the car for many of us BMW fans. We want the whole package and would prefer to trade a little horsepower for superioir chassis dynamics, fit and finish, etc.

That being said, I would gladly give up that F-150 and the Chrysler for a 545i Sport Pack. Time is just too precious. I want my ride to put a grin on my face. May be a little early to know, but I'll put my money on the BMW. We'll see just how comparable that 300C ends up being.
 

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Salsero2 said:
More for less eh?

If you want to quote advertised numbers, maybe so. But explain to me why the 330ci held its own against a 260 HP Infinity -- that's a 35 HP disadvantage. In fact, 0-60 the lower rated BMW was faster. I don't think that Chrysler will even come close to a 545 when you consider all the different parameters.

If advertised numbers blow your dress up, then you are right. But, I think for most of us, it takes more than factory advertised numbers to make an exceptional all around car. If you are into stop light wars or sitting around the bar bragging about how many ponies you have under your hood, then the Chrysler may be for you. Horsepower alone does not make the car for many of us BMW fans. We want the whole package and would prefer to trade a little horsepower for superioir chassis dynamics, fit and finish, etc.

That being said, I would gladly give up that F-150 and the Chrysler for a 545i Sport Pack. Time is just too precious. I want my ride to put a grin on my face. May be a little early to know, but I'll put my money on the BMW. We'll see just how comparable that 300C ends up being.
Listen, I’m a BMW owner and fan, and understand the Bimmer quality (control arm, ball joint, and misc. electrical problems notwithstanding). I know there is a quality difference between DC and BMW. A 545I is a fine piece of equipment that will have an edge over the 300C for overall performance for sure, but only moderately, and at a huge price point difference ($62,000 vs. $37,000).

Car and Driver Testing: (I've included their links, so please read if you’re interested)

300C with Price as tested: $37,760
Posting 5.3 to 60 and 13.9 quarter

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=8009&page_number=1

545I with Price as tested: $62,620
Posting 5.5 to 60 and 14.1 quarter

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=8011&page_number=1

Now imagine if I compared a $37,000 300C with 345 hp with a $45,000 525I with 225 hp, which by the way should be the car to compare with the 300C since it’s closer to it price range.

I love Bimmers, and have owned 3 in my lifetime, but I don’t blindly wave the BMW flag trying to keep myself from seeing good alternative vehicles. And do yourself a favor, drive a 300C before you dismiss it.

And sure, I'm willing to give up total hp for a better all around car just like you, but it gets a lot harder when that car cost $25,000 more, that's all I'm saying.
 

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SD 328I said:
Listen, I’m a BMW owner and fan, and understand the Bimmer quality (control arm, ball joint, and misc. electrical problems notwithstanding). I know there is a quality difference between DC and BMW. A 545I is a fine piece of equipment that will have an edge over the 300C for overall performance for sure, but only moderately, and at a huge price point difference ($62,000 vs. $37,000).

Car and Driver Testing: (I've included their links, so please read if you’re interested)

300C with Price as tested: $37,760
Posting 5.3 to 60 and 13.9 quarter

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=8009&page_number=1

545I with Price as tested: $62,620
Posting 5.5 to 60 and 14.1 quarter

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=8011&page_number=1

Now imagine if I compared a $37,000 300C with 345 hp with a $45,000 525I with 225 hp, which by the way should be the car to compare with the 300C since it’s closer to it price range.

I love Bimmers, and have owned 3 in my lifetime, but I don’t blindly wave the BMW flag trying to keep myself from seeing good alternative vehicles. And do yourself a favor, drive a 300C before you dismiss it.

And sure, I'm willing to give up total hp for a better all around car just like you, but it gets a lot harder when that car cost $25,000 more, that's all I'm saying.

I saw that quality response coming :thumbup:

The 300C is built up on a Merc E series chasis and seems to have the Merc V8 engine management for fuel economy. "5th Gear" seemed to like the 300C and said it had good heavy steering...not unlike..say...a...European car.
 

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wtf is wrong with you guys....comparing a 545 to a 300c? Ok lets bust out a "jeep is faster then a 325xi"
 

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bmw3series said:
wtf is wrong with you guys....comparing a 545 to a 300c? Ok lets bust out a "jeep is faster then a 325xi"

What don't you understand??? Let’s see...

Chrysler 300C:

Rear Drive, V8 Powered, Sedan


BMW 545I:

Rear Drive, V8 Powered, Sedan


We are comparing apples to apples here, a bit different than comparing a Jeep Grand Cherokee vs. 325XI.
 

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SD 328I said:
What don't you understand??? Let’s see...

Chrysler 300C:

Rear Drive, V8 Powered, Sedan


BMW 545I:

Rear Drive, V8 Powered, Sedan


We are comparing apples to apples here, a bit different than comparing a Jeep Grand Cherokee vs. 325XI.
thats so stupid...ok just because its got those 3 features doesnt make it anywhere as good as the 545. I have driven 545 and the feel of it is awesome and its quick as ****. Btw the 300c has no interior room for the size of it. The interior quality sucks ass , the brakes suck, too much road noise, no handling, and not as safe....ya, now i see why you like it so much because you are so into speed as you brought it up earliar. In your case get the 300c and save your money because most people here didnt buy their bmws for speed. Btw the 545 looks way nicer, you always get what you pay for. I would never compare the cars with eachother, i ahve driven both multiple times my father has owned a 300c and sold it after 2400 miles because it was stupid.
 

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bmw3series said:
...my father has owned a 300c and sold it after 2400 miles because it was stupid.
He sold it because it was stupid??? Did he even test drive the car before he purchased it?

This is only an example: Car & Driver picked 300c as its 10Best (so is the e46), but I don't see the e60 anywhere on the list.
 

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2006 5 series engines will be:

215hp 2.5L I6
255hp 3.0L I6
400-440hp 4.8L V8

I was originally told the new 545/645/745 would be 400hp (by a source "in the know") but Automobile Magazine just reported it would be 440hp in the redesigned 2006 745. Since that V8 will also power the 2006 545 and 645, expect 400-440 in those as well, and the 760 V12 gets bumped to 500hp.

While we're complaining about the cost of a 545i vs. a 300C, let's not forget that the vehicle the 300C is based on is an E class MB. An E430 costs the same as a 545 and doesn't have near the power or performance. Seriously, drive them both back to back, the 545 would absolutely run rings around the E430. To get even remotely close to the performance you need an E500, and even then it only competes in a straight line, and still loses. An E500 also costs MORE than a 545i, by quite a bit. If one of these vehicles should be chastised for not offering as much bang for the buck as the 300C (which is a great value, I admit) then it's the E class. It costs twice as much or more as the 300C that is its own offspring. Using the 300C as a barometer isn't really a fair comparison -- every luxury brand vehicle with a V8 or 300hp+ V6 (be it Audi, MB, BMW, Acura, whatever) costs a bunch more than that car. By that rationale everyone should be driving 300C's. The fact of the matter is, however, that these vehicles are not considered equals, and never will be.

It's not all about price or you shouldn't be buying a BMW, MB, Audi, Acura, whatever in the first place. If price was all that mattered, these brands wouldn't even exist. They're not NEED purchases, they're WANT purchases. I WANT a 545i, knowing full well it'll cost me more than a 300C by a significant margin, same as I wanted my 330Ci when I knew full well I could build a 500hp Mustang for half the money. You either WANT the car or you don't.
 

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bmw3series said:
thats so stupid...ok just because its got those 3 features doesnt make it anywhere as good as the 545. I have driven 545 and the feel of it is awesome and its quick as ****. Btw the 300c has no interior room for the size of it. The interior quality sucks ass , the brakes suck, too much road noise, no handling, and not as safe....ya, now i see why you like it so much because you are so into speed as you brought it up earliar. In your case get the 300c and save your money because most people here didnt buy their bmws for speed. Btw the 545 looks way nicer, you always get what you pay for. I would never compare the cars with eachother, i ahve driven both multiple times my father has owned a 300c and sold it after 2400 miles because it was stupid.
What's your problem Bmw3series? "That’s so stupid…" Why is it so stupid? You sound like a BMW elitist who can't stand the idea of other car makes building cars that are good alternatives to your own.

I'm doing my best not to flame you (trying really hard), but you really need to relax. Just because it's not a BMW doesn't mean we are stupid for comparing it to one.

Plus, your father has owned a 300C and sold it after 2,400 miles because it was stupid sounds very very convenient, trying to support your post are we???
 
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