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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I had my rear subframe cracking fixed/ reinforced with plates last year. I was thinking of buying the mason engineering fixed gtr brace for extra support. What would be the best option to prevent cracking? I drift the car a lot and drive it pretty aggressively.
 

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'02 330i 5-Speed
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Here you go:

 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I don’t wanna have the subframe pulled again considering I spent a lot of money a year ago to have it done. Would the cmp stage 2 & 2.5 kit require the subframe to be pulled to install? Also are there any x braces that’ll do the job just as good as the vincebar or cmp? What does the vincebar do that the x braces don’t?
 

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2003 M3 6MT Slicktop
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I don’t wanna have the subframe pulled again considering I spent a lot of money a year ago to have it done. Would the cmp stage 2 & 2.5 kit require the subframe to be pulled to install? Also are there any x braces that’ll do the job just as good as the vincebar or cmp? What does the vincebar do that the x braces don’t?
Vince Bar also addresses the front two mounts. And ties the rear two mounting blocks (to the bar) side to side to the side rails.
I just recently seen a high mileage M3 with only the front right mount cracked at floor while other three were fine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Vince Bar also addresses the front two mounts. And ties the rear two mounting blocks (to the bar) side to side to the side rails.
I just recently seen a high mileage M3 with only the front right mount cracked at floor while other three were fine.
You’re talking about the front shock mounts where the suspension sits in the engine bay? I don’t see that
 

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You did ask specifically for the best option from people who work on these cars...

An integrated structural reinforcement, like the vince bar ties together the main structural features of the chassis and distributes loading across a larger area. Based on currently having my subframe out and having drilled through the subframe mounts and up through to the interior floor, there's no way a bolt on solution will match tying everything together structurally.

If you don't want to pull your subframe out, don't and pick a bolt on option. I doubt these guys are going to validate your opinion.
 

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You’re talking about the front shock mounts where the suspension sits in the engine bay? I don’t see that
Subframe has 4 mounts. Most kits address the 2 rear ones. Vincent's kit does all 4. if you see my diy you'll understand.

I have beaten the crap out of the car and normal subframe mounts would had gone long time ago. Not "burnout or drift stuff" but tuned a whole gearbox from 0 with 600nm of torque. It was not gentle. All bushes are gone, half-shafts, etc, except the subframe mounts. Stilll perfect. So, with personal experience + time, this is the best kit around.
 

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2003 M3 6MT Slicktop
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You’re talking about the front shock mounts where the suspension sits in the engine bay? I don’t see that
no I’m talking about the two front “RACP”mounting locations. the subframe mounts at four locations. the front Right and rear Left are the ones that crack first because of the torque rocking the differential.

the Mason GTR bar will provide extra support.
but it’s not the best option. you want the two forward mounts also reinforced from the top side. Vince Bar and the CMP products have that option. Vince Bar is the original best design.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
So basically you’re saying that the x brace will only reinforce the rear mounts but cmp reinforces all four? Do you have to remove the subframe to install the cmp? I would go with them over the vincebar.
 

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2003 M3 6MT Slicktop
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So basically you’re saying that the x brace will only reinforce the rear mounts but cmp reinforces all four? Do you have to remove the subframe to install the cmp? I would go with them over the vincebar.
cmp and Vince Bar have option to reinforce the fronts. cmp requires the rear main to be bought to add the front. Vince Bar you can just buy the front gusset cups by themselves. so for example if you had already bought the Mason gtr bar you could add the Vince fronts.

both are “Top side” reinforcements that also utilize a longer stud that goes from top inside car to bottom of car. think you’d only need to lower subframe enough so you can remove the front two studs that screw in and by a wide hex base. the rear two are bolts. these need to be removed so you can drill up thru the hole to the topside.
but nothing like dropping gas tank and whole rear for the plate welding you did before from bottom side.

Vince kit has option for installing with industrial aero space epoxy and rivets. so no welding with that kit. the other kit you have welding from inside trunk and back seat area.
58B8BCCB-EF76-499E-9352-C9B234E07EF6.jpeg
 

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2003 330i ZHP 2005 330i ZHP
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This is what I did for my subframe in my ZHP.

 

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Based on currently having my subframe out and having drilled through the subframe mounts and up through to the interior floor, there's no way a bolt on solution will match tying everything together structurally.
Not quite. There are bolt on solutions that will do that. I have the SME X-Brace which is full bolt-on and is basically just a less complicated and cheaper Mason bar.

929675


For the front mounts, one can just do what mdjarg in his thread that he posted above.
 

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Not quite. There are bolt on solutions that will do that. I have the SME X-Brace which is full bolt-on and is basically just a less complicated and cheaper Mason bar.

View attachment 929675

For the front mounts, one can just do what mdjarg in his thread that he posted above.
I don't entirely disagree but it does look like you are at least unbolting the rear subframe to drill holes, which the OP was trying to avoid. I'm not quite seeing how this one ties the unibody "rail sections" together so much as triangulating a couple of more fixed points on the the vehicle.
 

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I don't entirely disagree but it does look like you are at least unbolting the rear subframe to drill holes, which the OP was trying to avoid. I'm not quite seeing how this one ties the unibody "rail sections" together so much as triangulating a couple of more fixed points on the the vehicle.
The subframe stays in place and doesn't move although you do of course use longer bolts. Didn't even have to remove the exhaust for that, just unbolted the hangers and moved it to the side. The shock towers are welded to the rails so the forces are ultimately absorbed by the rails. It's not as direct as the Vincebar but the installation is significantly easier. I do think this is the bolt-on solution that OP is looking for. The X-Brace can be done in a couple hours. I don't think there is any easier/faster solution than that.
 

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The subframe stays in place an doesn't move although you do of course use longer bolts. Didn't even have to remove the exhaust for that, just unbolted the hangars and moved it to the side. The shock towers are welded to the rails so the forces are ultimately absorbed by the rails. It's not as direct as the Vincebar but the installation is significantly easier. I do think this is the bolt-on solution that OP is looking for. The X-Brace can be done in a couple hours. I don't think there is any easier/faster solution than that.
What does the carpeting look like after everything's been put back in?
 
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