Joined
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270 Posts
Ok Guys,
The problem: Obviously people have done it (m3 to non m e46), however it seems they don’t share the wiring info or are very wolly about it. This has to change. The e30 and e36 guys share plenty on how to… wire. E46, either im bling, cant search properly or they simply don’t share in detail on how to wire the damn thing.
The solution: lets get together and smash it out, nice and simply so anyone wishing to do it has the confidence with easy to follow detail on how.
My Scenario: I have and e46 98 323i manual (m52b25tu). About 6 month ago I converted it to m54b30. A VERY basic swap. Used all m54 gear engine wise. Used the wiring info provided from these guys,
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929951
They are legends. Made it all very simple. It would have been 10 times harder to change manifolds and use the m52 throttle cable manifold instead of simply running 6 wires to the pedal. Despite that info being available I still see many noubs claiming the swap is difficult and best to run with an m52 manifold, all I can do is shake my head. The total swap took no longer than 2 days, and that included drinking VB throughout https://www.victoriabitter.com.au/***8206;
Anyway, lets put the same thing together for ms43 –> mss54. It cannot be any more difficult.
Basically I have acquired an 02 m3 smg complete car (smashed) so have everything needed to help make it straight forward and share all the info with the community.
The plan: get the engine and wiring done, run my existing drive line (for the time being), abuse the hell out of it, and see what of the 330 I can break. (when I swapped in the m54, I did everything, front to back, sustemsion, diff, subframe including tms rio kit, brakes everything..) Once I break something, il throw in the m drive line and convert the smg to a manual.
When I put the s54 in, il remove the smg wiring from whatever lies in the engine harness, smg is not for me, personally I think it’s a joke, however, respect and each to there own.
Anyway, I poked around with a few things the last few hours and this is what has been discovered as FACT.
- The M3 cluser was pludged in for a laugh, see what happens. NOW, it works almost 100%. The rev indicator and oil temp work perfect as they should in an M3, which obviously indicates a non M cluser also receive these signals. So myths aside, the damn thing works, period.
Issues with M3 cluser are as follows:
- SMG Gear indicator and Limp mode COG. These can easily be coded out in 5 minutes using ncs expert and editing the vehicle order in the AKMB and EWS. Il provide specific details on this later (when I get the motor in), but lets just say a monkey could do it. After its done, the cluser and ews will be coded as a manual, its basic.
- The s54 cluser temp gauge runs a little over half way. Obviously my car does not over heat, only explanation I have for this is the s54 wants to run a little cooler than the m54 so the operating range on the clusters is slightly different (by probably a few degrees). This will fix itself as soon as the s54 goes in.
- The only other issue is the park brake light is constanly illuminated with the m3 cluster, this one im not sure about, but considering im still running the m54, who knows. Im hardly concened about it for now.
So the cluser works as it should, end of story. Well at least in my manual it does. If anyone really wants, when I code SMG out of the cluser I can try add the normal auto code 205 to the vehicle order in the AKMB and EWS and see if it shows the normal automatic display, incase anyone with an auto wants to swap in the m3 cluser and aint worried about the positionof the water temp indicator which on a non m would sit just past half way, instead of just before.
A quick comparison on cluser wiring between the 323i and m3 shows the following:
Left side white small plug on 323 is missing: (missing means its on the m3)
Pin 7 – (black with yellow trace on m)
Pin 14 – (Black with red trace on m)
Right Side black blug on 323i HAS EVERYTHING the M3 has. On this side the M3 is Missing
Pin 7 and Pin 18.
- Anyone with WDS feel free to elaborate on what these are ?
Personally I have NFI why people are swapping entire body harnesses? Unless im missing something obvious, I for the life of me cant understand it. In my eyes it would be a massive PATA so, I think the easiest way is simply to compare the 323i and M3 engine / body harnesses and move aroun d and snake throught whats required. I spent 30 mins comparing and documenting the differences on this this just now and all finding are as follows:
Firstly understand the following:
Lets call the DME (engine ecu) connection X5, X4, X3, X2 and X1. X5 being 1st on the left X4 second on the left and so on.
X5 – This is irrelevant to a swap. X5 runs from the engine harness to the DME and also makes a connection to the DME box. When doing a swap if you get a complete engine harness and box this simply plugs in there.
X4 – This runs from DME to the Body and obvious is very important to make things work. Ive complared the 2 and discoveries as follows:
The 323 body harness (setup for ms43 after m54 swap) is missing the follwosing Pins:
Pin 1 - Blue on M3
Pin 3 – Brown on M3
Pin 6 – Blakc with Blue stripe on M3
Pin 11 – Brown with Green Stripe on M3
Pin 15 – Black with red stripe and yellow dots on M3
Pin 16 – Black with Green stripe and yellow dots on M3
Pin 21 – White with green stripe on M3
Pin 34 Brown with Gray
The M3 harness at X4 is Missing the following pins which the 323 Has.
Pin 17
Pin 23
Pin 28.
EVERYTHING ELSE IS EXACTLY THE SAME PIN SPOT AND COLOUR BETWEEN THE HARNESSES AT X4.
X3 – Like X1 is irrelevant since it comes from engine direct to DME
X2 – Is another body harness so lets compare like we did with X4.
The 323 is missing the following Pins which the M3 harness has.
Pin 5 – Brown
Pin 7 – Brown
Pin 10 – Blue with black
Pin 11 Black with purple
Pin 16 – Yellow
Pin 18 – Yellow
Pin 19 – Brown
Pin 22 – Yellow
The M3 harness on X2 is Missing Pin 20 which is on the 323 harness.
X1 – This is the Final Body Harness so again lets compare whats missing.
The 323 is missing the following Pins which the M3 harness has.
Pin 2 – Fat Red
Pin 3 – White with purple stripe
So that’s the basic findings, as it stands it seems basic to wire things up so I don’t know where and why people are swapping whole body harnesses and or others who claim the wiring is a nightmare and days weeks upon end. It seems very straight forward from my 30 minute findings.
Anyway, I bought this m3 (smahed for almost beer money, a few k) and they are getting cheaper, so guys, lets put this things together and everyone who wants to get there hands a little dirty can have an s54.
Any volunteers to help Pin things out (and nicely draw it up, im real bad at that) just like the guys that did ms42 – ms43 ? Ideally if anyone knows any of these guys, get them in on things, they did an awesome job on the ms43.
WE CAN DO IT
Once we got the wiring worked out, il have the m54 out and s54 in and wired within a day or 2 max.
(It would be real nice if some of the guys who have actually done the swap, share the detailing info, however something tells me its not gonna happen)
The problem: Obviously people have done it (m3 to non m e46), however it seems they don’t share the wiring info or are very wolly about it. This has to change. The e30 and e36 guys share plenty on how to… wire. E46, either im bling, cant search properly or they simply don’t share in detail on how to wire the damn thing.
The solution: lets get together and smash it out, nice and simply so anyone wishing to do it has the confidence with easy to follow detail on how.
My Scenario: I have and e46 98 323i manual (m52b25tu). About 6 month ago I converted it to m54b30. A VERY basic swap. Used all m54 gear engine wise. Used the wiring info provided from these guys,
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=929951
They are legends. Made it all very simple. It would have been 10 times harder to change manifolds and use the m52 throttle cable manifold instead of simply running 6 wires to the pedal. Despite that info being available I still see many noubs claiming the swap is difficult and best to run with an m52 manifold, all I can do is shake my head. The total swap took no longer than 2 days, and that included drinking VB throughout https://www.victoriabitter.com.au/***8206;
Anyway, lets put the same thing together for ms43 –> mss54. It cannot be any more difficult.
Basically I have acquired an 02 m3 smg complete car (smashed) so have everything needed to help make it straight forward and share all the info with the community.
The plan: get the engine and wiring done, run my existing drive line (for the time being), abuse the hell out of it, and see what of the 330 I can break. (when I swapped in the m54, I did everything, front to back, sustemsion, diff, subframe including tms rio kit, brakes everything..) Once I break something, il throw in the m drive line and convert the smg to a manual.
When I put the s54 in, il remove the smg wiring from whatever lies in the engine harness, smg is not for me, personally I think it’s a joke, however, respect and each to there own.
Anyway, I poked around with a few things the last few hours and this is what has been discovered as FACT.
- The M3 cluser was pludged in for a laugh, see what happens. NOW, it works almost 100%. The rev indicator and oil temp work perfect as they should in an M3, which obviously indicates a non M cluser also receive these signals. So myths aside, the damn thing works, period.
Issues with M3 cluser are as follows:
- SMG Gear indicator and Limp mode COG. These can easily be coded out in 5 minutes using ncs expert and editing the vehicle order in the AKMB and EWS. Il provide specific details on this later (when I get the motor in), but lets just say a monkey could do it. After its done, the cluser and ews will be coded as a manual, its basic.
- The s54 cluser temp gauge runs a little over half way. Obviously my car does not over heat, only explanation I have for this is the s54 wants to run a little cooler than the m54 so the operating range on the clusters is slightly different (by probably a few degrees). This will fix itself as soon as the s54 goes in.
- The only other issue is the park brake light is constanly illuminated with the m3 cluster, this one im not sure about, but considering im still running the m54, who knows. Im hardly concened about it for now.
So the cluser works as it should, end of story. Well at least in my manual it does. If anyone really wants, when I code SMG out of the cluser I can try add the normal auto code 205 to the vehicle order in the AKMB and EWS and see if it shows the normal automatic display, incase anyone with an auto wants to swap in the m3 cluser and aint worried about the positionof the water temp indicator which on a non m would sit just past half way, instead of just before.
A quick comparison on cluser wiring between the 323i and m3 shows the following:
Left side white small plug on 323 is missing: (missing means its on the m3)
Pin 7 – (black with yellow trace on m)
Pin 14 – (Black with red trace on m)
Right Side black blug on 323i HAS EVERYTHING the M3 has. On this side the M3 is Missing
Pin 7 and Pin 18.
- Anyone with WDS feel free to elaborate on what these are ?
Personally I have NFI why people are swapping entire body harnesses? Unless im missing something obvious, I for the life of me cant understand it. In my eyes it would be a massive PATA so, I think the easiest way is simply to compare the 323i and M3 engine / body harnesses and move aroun d and snake throught whats required. I spent 30 mins comparing and documenting the differences on this this just now and all finding are as follows:
Firstly understand the following:
Lets call the DME (engine ecu) connection X5, X4, X3, X2 and X1. X5 being 1st on the left X4 second on the left and so on.
X5 – This is irrelevant to a swap. X5 runs from the engine harness to the DME and also makes a connection to the DME box. When doing a swap if you get a complete engine harness and box this simply plugs in there.
X4 – This runs from DME to the Body and obvious is very important to make things work. Ive complared the 2 and discoveries as follows:
The 323 body harness (setup for ms43 after m54 swap) is missing the follwosing Pins:
Pin 1 - Blue on M3
Pin 3 – Brown on M3
Pin 6 – Blakc with Blue stripe on M3
Pin 11 – Brown with Green Stripe on M3
Pin 15 – Black with red stripe and yellow dots on M3
Pin 16 – Black with Green stripe and yellow dots on M3
Pin 21 – White with green stripe on M3
Pin 34 Brown with Gray
The M3 harness at X4 is Missing the following pins which the 323 Has.
Pin 17
Pin 23
Pin 28.
EVERYTHING ELSE IS EXACTLY THE SAME PIN SPOT AND COLOUR BETWEEN THE HARNESSES AT X4.
X3 – Like X1 is irrelevant since it comes from engine direct to DME
X2 – Is another body harness so lets compare like we did with X4.
The 323 is missing the following Pins which the M3 harness has.
Pin 5 – Brown
Pin 7 – Brown
Pin 10 – Blue with black
Pin 11 Black with purple
Pin 16 – Yellow
Pin 18 – Yellow
Pin 19 – Brown
Pin 22 – Yellow
The M3 harness on X2 is Missing Pin 20 which is on the 323 harness.
X1 – This is the Final Body Harness so again lets compare whats missing.
The 323 is missing the following Pins which the M3 harness has.
Pin 2 – Fat Red
Pin 3 – White with purple stripe
So that’s the basic findings, as it stands it seems basic to wire things up so I don’t know where and why people are swapping whole body harnesses and or others who claim the wiring is a nightmare and days weeks upon end. It seems very straight forward from my 30 minute findings.
Anyway, I bought this m3 (smahed for almost beer money, a few k) and they are getting cheaper, so guys, lets put this things together and everyone who wants to get there hands a little dirty can have an s54.
Any volunteers to help Pin things out (and nicely draw it up, im real bad at that) just like the guys that did ms42 – ms43 ? Ideally if anyone knows any of these guys, get them in on things, they did an awesome job on the ms43.
WE CAN DO IT
Once we got the wiring worked out, il have the m54 out and s54 in and wired within a day or 2 max.
(It would be real nice if some of the guys who have actually done the swap, share the detailing info, however something tells me its not gonna happen)
