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Old 04-09-2019, 05:57 AM   #1
Bmsluite
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Trans fluid for 6 speed?

This winter I put in Redline D4 ATF and it shifted nicely. Now that it is warm it has gotten very notchy and I have feel my synchros suffering.

6 speed getrag

What transmission fluid do you use and why?

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Old 04-09-2019, 06:57 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
This winter I put in Redline D4 ATF and it shifted nicely. Now that it is warm it has gotten very notchy and I have feel my synchros suffering.

6 speed getrag

What transmission fluid do you use and why?

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As per service manual

Last edited by RayPooley; 01-13-2020 at 02:07 PM.
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Old 04-09-2019, 07:40 AM   #3
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Leave the Redline fluid in the transmission. Itís fine for year round use.
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Old 04-09-2019, 09:48 AM   #4
Bmsluite
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Originally Posted by RayPooley View Post
As per service manual
If you put that fluid in you won't be able to get into 1st gear in under 20F

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Old 04-09-2019, 11:25 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
If you put that fluid in you won't be able to get into 1st gear in under 20F

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Well if you're going to ignore the manufacturers recommened specification then you should just put what you like in there since you know better than they do. I don't know why you bothered asking the question.
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Old 04-09-2019, 11:42 AM   #6
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Well if you're going to ignore the manufacturers recommened specification then you should just put what you like in there since you know better than they do. I don't know why you bothered asking the question.
You can't drive the drive in the cold with that fluid. The trans says on it to use ATF fluid. BMW says to put in MTF. Who you going to trust? BMW? Or Getrag? The real manufacturer of the fluid

I know it's hard to swallow but BMW is wrong sometimes.

I am looking for a better aftermarket fluid because I believe in improvement. Not infallibility of a company

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Old 04-09-2019, 12:45 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
You can't drive the drive in the cold with that fluid. The trans says on it to use ATF fluid. BMW says to put in MTF. Who you going to trust? BMW? Or Getrag? The real manufacturer of the fluid

I know it's hard to swallow but BMW is wrong sometimes.

I am looking for a better aftermarket fluid because I believe in improvement. Not infallibility of a company

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I believe the operating temperature rangle for the BMW bmw MTF-IT-1 spec is -30 to +120 degrees centigrade. That seems more than adequate.

Last edited by RayPooley; 04-09-2019 at 12:51 PM.
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Old 04-09-2019, 02:00 PM   #8
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1:1 mix RedLine D4ATF : MTL.
Works great for me all year round.
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Old 04-09-2019, 03:25 PM   #9
Bmsluite
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Originally Posted by RayPooley View Post
I believe the operating temperature rangle for the BMW bmw MTF-IT-1 spec is -30 to +120 degrees centigrade. That seems more than adequate.
But you can't shift into 1st in under 20F much less at - 20F with their MTF. Trust me on this. Go ahead and try it if you don't believe me

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Old 04-09-2019, 03:25 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Megalocnus View Post
1:1 mix RedLine D4ATF : MTL.
Works great for me all year round.
I might try this. Thanks

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Old 04-09-2019, 06:50 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
But you can't shift into 1st in under 20F much less at - 20F with their MTF. Trust me on this. Go ahead and try it if you don't believe me

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What exactly can't shift into 1st? gear grind noise, or it doesn't move into gear? or it needs a little more arm muscle to pull into gear?
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Old 04-09-2019, 06:52 PM   #12
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Now that it is warm it has gotten very notchy and I have feel my synchros suffering.
synchro suffering. Exactly what? grinding when shift?
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Old 04-09-2019, 07:57 PM   #13
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It just won't get through the gate when you're stopped at a red light. You have to either pull it back into second and then again into 1st or rev it up in neutral.

Basically it won't spin up the synchro.

With the redline ATF fluid I don't have any problems. When the redline fluid is hot it's fantastic but at normal Temps in regular weather it is notchy

I did all the shifter bushings at the same time as the fluid so that probably adds to to notchy feeling. I can feel the synchros through the lever A LOT better now

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Old 04-10-2019, 02:09 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
But you can't shift into 1st in under 20F much less at - 20F with their MTF. Trust me on this. Go ahead and try it if you don't believe me

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We are no stranger to -20 here in the UK. Doesn't happen often but it happens. Last time was about 4 years ago. I had no problems changing gears. As far as I am aware my transmission oil is standard.
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Old 04-10-2019, 06:03 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by RayPooley View Post
We are no stranger to -20 here in the UK. Doesn't happen often but it happens. Last time was about 4 years ago. I had no problems changing gears. As far as I am aware my transmission oil is standard.
Which fluid do you have? Do you have the new MTF-LT-2? Because that stuff sucks

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Old 04-10-2019, 06:58 AM   #16
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I only use Redline MTL in my 5 speed and should work perfectly well with a 6 speed. Can drive it year round in Ohio without issues. Frankly - your problems does not seem to be fluid related imho.
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Old 04-10-2019, 07:04 AM   #17
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I only use Redline MTL in my 5 speed and should work perfectly well with a 6 speed. Can drive it year round in Ohio without issues. Frankly - your problems does not seem to be fluid related imho.


^^^THIS^^^! Just leave the Redline in the transmission. Redline products are top notch.
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Old 04-10-2019, 10:23 AM   #18
Bmsluite
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I only use Redline MTL in my 5 speed and should work perfectly well with a 6 speed. Can drive it year round in Ohio without issues. Frankly - your problems does not seem to be fluid related imho.
The 5 speed is a very different transmission made by a different company. The 6 speed is a Getrag and says right on it to use ATF fluid NOT MTF. Getrag makes much more complex and exotic transmissions than ZF.

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Old 04-10-2019, 12:58 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
It just won't get through the gate when you're stopped at a red light. You have to either pull it back into second and then again into 1st or rev it up in neutral.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
You have to either pull it back into second and then again into 1st or rev it up in neutral.
My head is spinning by the synchro here.
At the stop light the output shaft is zero speed but the input shaft is 700rpm idling. So to shift into 1st, the 1st/2nd slider has to bring the 1st gear on the input shaft to zero speed by pushing the synchro ring into the 1st gear to slow it down to zero (not speed it up as you said or thought), then the slider slides into the 1st gear dogteeth.

"either pull it back into second and then again into 1st or rev it up in neutral"
I know exactly your problem here. Do this next time: don't need to rev up in neutral before trying into 1st again, but just shift to neutral, release clutch, press clutch and timely shift to 1st. Do you ride the clutch pedal while waiting at the light? I assume you were in neutral with clutch released, and when light turned green, you step on clutch but a little slow shifting to 1st. The delay time between step on pedal and shift, and the thicker cold oil, allowed the input shaft stopped completely, and if the slider's teeth and the gear teeth were all line up perfect then they were in collision and could not slide the teeth over. This is why the thinner hot oil doesn't stop the input shaft this fast and you had no gear teeth line up "collision" scenario.

It is not the oil but the technique: When cold oil: de-clutch and move the shifter smooth with minimum delay. When hot oil, de-clutch and move the shifter slow to give more time for the synchro to slow down or speed up the selected gear to match up their speed.



"it won't get through the gate"
Are you talking race horse? The gate is the forth/aft straight plane for a set of 2 gears such as 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, or R. So if the shifter was pulled to 1/2 gate, then pull it back to shift 1st and push it forward to shift 2nd. What get through the gate means? You couldn't shift into 1st with all your muscle effort? C'on give some specific description and not "get through the gate" which I have never learned from any where in the tranny tech books.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
Basically it won't spin up the synchro.
The synchro doesn't spin itself up relative to anything near to it; the synchro is to spin up or slow down the selected gear to match with the slider rotating speed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bmsluite View Post
With the redline ATF fluid I don't have any problems. When the redline fluid is hot it's fantastic but at normal Temps in regular weather it is notchy
As explained above, it is the technique and not the oil. For the heavier MTF, it will slow down the gear even fast then you have more probability of getting gears line up "collision" with cold oil, because you have too much delay in between.
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Old 04-10-2019, 08:15 PM   #20
zi46
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Over the past 6 years I have tried different combinations of the Red Line fluids (D4 ATF / MTL) on my 6-speed 330i . After about a year the shifting would turn notchy.
Currently I am using the Fuchs TITAN SINTOFLUID 75W-80 fluid for over 2 years and it still shifts smooth consistently.

Last edited by zi46; 04-10-2019 at 08:15 PM.
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