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Old 04-09-2012, 01:29 AM   #1
Bdave
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Steed Speed Flow Bench results

I dont know about you. But I find the following pretty exciting. There is no practical results yet. When there is(dyno results) you will be the first to know. When? I have no idea. Dont hold your breath. This year I would hope.

"I have the results here, but it's not really legible by the average joe, or me for that matter. . .it's just a bunch of data laid out on a spread sheet. With your permission, I'm going to have the actual person who ported your manifold give you a buzz on the phone tomorrow. Let me know it's OK to give him your cell. . .he will be able to explain to you the reason it took so freakin long, but trust me, after you speak with him you'll realize it was worth the long wait. He told me efficiency is 10 fold now on the turbo and waste gate side(now it is port matched), and there is a good deal more volume in there now, and smoothness. Great stuff."

I like the Steed and think it has a lot going for it over a welded up tube job.
Whether it is going to be so fantastic in real world use remains to be seen. Six EGT ports have also been drilled and tapped. Things look promising at least. We are pursuing basic fundamentals of engine breathing. All is going according to plan except the monumental burden of prodigious time added to the project. Its been overwhelming I have to say.

New, super fast Synapse Synchronic BOV's were added too.





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Old 04-09-2012, 03:06 AM   #2
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Interesting....but I look forward to when you start providing your own media (pictures/video/data) of topics related to your build.

I have been lied to about technical details when asking for data on my own projects. If data isn't able to be provided that clearly explains why something is "different", than nothing is proven. Similar to when someone says an exhaust manifold is creating too much back pressure, but has no sensors in place to measure this back pressure.
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Old 04-09-2012, 04:55 AM   #3
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Well I am really curious about the results , I hope it works out nicely and improves the flow and reduces ur egt values
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:00 AM   #4
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Interesting....but I look forward to when you start providing your own media (pictures/video/data) of topics related to your build.

I have been lied to about technical details when asking for data on my own projects. If data isn't able to be provided that clearly explains why something is "different", than nothing is proven. Similar to when someone says an exhaust manifold is creating too much back pressure, but has no sensors in place to measure this back pressure.
By all means, be skeptical. Until I have dyno data, its all conjecture. Even flow numbers can be faked. I will be reporting the general content of the phone call from the very shop owner that did the work and report whether I find that they have a history of shoddy work or debunking their customers. Or not.

I would not mind seeing at least a photo of the work done. I am quite surprised none were forth coming(yet) I paid to have the entire mani split, ported, re welded and re ceramic coated.

However, there is that possibility that the glass is half full and results will speak for themselves. Nothing to do but wait then I suppose. Porting of intake and exhaust manifolds goes on all the time for a variety of cars and motorcycles. Its not beyond the realm of possibility for a job like mine to come out quite successfully.
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Old 04-09-2012, 01:27 PM   #5
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What was the total cost ?
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Old 04-09-2012, 03:45 PM   #6
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What was the total cost ?
At last notice: 1,100usd. It may have gone higher. But that is what I paid so far.
1) Cut the welds and split the manifold. It splits nicely in HALF.
2) Port and polish for increased flow AND velocity
3)Drill and tap for six EGT probes. Make shaped bungs for probe holes.
4) We weld
5) Re coat in ceramic.

We dont think there are huge amounts of lost HP waiting to be recovered,,,just a significant amount. Also, more power with less boost and lower EGT's. That is our hope.
No phone conference yet.
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:22 PM   #7
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Well if u could improve the spool up and lower the egt values it would be worth the price
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:30 PM   #8
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Could've just asked Leen to build you a custom one...prolly wouldn't have cost that much either.
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Old 04-10-2012, 07:48 AM   #9
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By all means, be skeptical. Until I have dyno data, its all conjecture. Even flow numbers can be faked. I will be reporting the general content of the phone call from the very shop owner that did the work and report whether I find that they have a history of shoddy work or debunking their customers. Or not.

I would not mind seeing at least a photo of the work done. I am quite surprised none were forth coming(yet) I paid to have the entire mani split, ported, re welded and re ceramic coated.

However, there is that possibility that the glass is half full and results will speak for themselves. Nothing to do but wait then I suppose. Porting of intake and exhaust manifolds goes on all the time for a variety of cars and motorcycles. Its not beyond the realm of possibility for a job like mine to come out quite successfully.
Sounds like you are at the mercy of what you are being told, not shown.

I'd like to think that someone with unlimited CNC options would not leave anything on the table due to the port shape. That said, do you know if material was added or subtracted from the ports? Which shop is doing the work?

Regarding the EGT Probes: Are you using an EMS that has the ability to trim individual cylinder fuel and timing?
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Old 04-10-2012, 01:39 PM   #10
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Sounds like you are at the mercy of what you are being told, not shown.

I'd like to think that someone with unlimited CNC options would not leave anything on the table due to the port shape. That said, do you know if material was added or subtracted from the ports? Which shop is doing the work?

Regarding the EGT Probes: Are you using an EMS that has the ability to trim individual cylinder fuel and timing?
Arent we all really? Until the fat lady sings. No one is more interested than me if my money was well or ill spent. I have information to base my decision making on that you are not privy to, however.

Regarding shape etc...Those are questions I had for the porter, I will make his shop public if he will allow. I am upset he has not called me yet as my tech promised. But a good porter will both add and remove material to gain flow.Any body can go in with as dremel and hog out a port. it takes a real experianced hand to go in, weld up floors, and smooth things anound to gain flow + velocity. A flow BENCH is invaluable. His was out of repair/calibration for a few weeks prior to my project. He got all that sorted out BEFORE he started on my project. Thats why it took longer than we thought.

Leen wasnt interested in doing any porting. I have been keeping him up to speed on current work. In the future, depending on what results i will get, anything is possible.

My EGTs will not be hooked up to any active systems. They are in place for diagnostic and tuning purposes on the dyno. There has been a long thread on the issues surrounding active tuning using constant info from an EGT bank. I would have to say, I did not understand all of it. The thread can be found I think with a simple search. As far as tuning goes I think my tuner should be able to pull add timing and fuel from individual cylinders. If not, a colder spark plug can always be used in any cylinder that is running significantly hotter than others. I need any dangerously high EGT's identified and dealt with. It wold be foolish not to at least record them.
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Old 04-10-2012, 07:53 PM   #11
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My EGTs will not be hooked up to any active systems. They are in place for diagnostic and tuning purposes on the dyno. There has been a long thread on the issues surrounding active tuning using constant info from an EGT bank. I would have to say, I did not understand all of it. The thread can be found I think with a simple search. As far as tuning goes I think my tuner should be able to pull add timing and fuel from individual cylinders. If not, a colder spark plug can always be used in any cylinder that is running significantly hotter than others. I need any dangerously high EGT's identified and dealt with. It wold be foolish not to at least record them.
I think you are smart to add sensors to your engine program.

My question isn't about closed loop control based on EGT data, my question is whether the ECU you will use can trim fuel and timing in each cylinder individually. Can it do this?

Running a mix of heat range spark plugs is a band aid, not a solution to the cause of inconsistent EGTs.
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Old 04-10-2012, 08:15 PM   #12
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I think you are smart to add sensors to your engine program.

My question isn't about closed loop control based on EGT data, my question is whether the ECU you will use can trim fuel and timing in each cylinder individually. Can it do this?

Running a mix of heat range spark plugs is a band aid, not a solution to the cause of inconsistent EGTs.
Yes, I actually answered both questions. The one you asked and the one you did not ask, but some other guys had queried me.
No to closed loop control.
AFAIK, yes to individual cylinder control.
Who is to say that all EGTs wont be in acceptable levels.? Its possible! Its something that absolutely needs to be done, porting or not IMO.

I want to know, NEED to know my individual EGT's. The Suburu guys and some Supra guys are doing this to avoid FRIED valves. Not that there has been a lot of that going around lately with HPF and BMW's, but EGTs are taken for granted too many times.
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