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Old 04-05-2012, 06:03 PM   #1
HPF Chris
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Thumbs Up Kevin's E85 BURNING HPF Stage 1 Turbo BMW M3 w/HPF-AEM

Kevin drove and raced his E46 M3 with our stage 2 and 2.5 turbo kits for several years. He recently bought another gorgeous white E46 "SMG" M3 and shipped it to us for our HPF/AEM "E85" tune. This car is running our standard stage 1 turbo system with no other modifications except for our in tank walbro pump upgrade, FIC injectors and E85 for fuel. The switch on his steering column switches between low boost (6psi) and high boost (12psi). The car is so quiet and so smooth. A 620rwhp "stealth" daily driver is very cool.

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Last edited by HPF Chris; 04-05-2012 at 06:08 PM.
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Old 04-05-2012, 06:09 PM   #2
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Chris, have Kirk call me. I want this
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Old 04-05-2012, 06:13 PM   #3
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Wow nice!! This is great for people who don't want to spend extra money to swap everything
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Old 04-05-2012, 06:41 PM   #4
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Old 04-05-2012, 06:41 PM   #5
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Wow nice!! This is great for people who don't want to spend extra money to swap everything
x2
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Old 04-05-2012, 07:00 PM   #6
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Awesome! I mentioned doing this same thing to my car and you never commented. I assumed you were against it. I guess not!

I still have some developmental questions. Chris, what happens if the owner ever runs out of E85 and cant find a station that sells it? I am assuming that this is NOT a flex fuel situation.

Also how does the owner keep from blowing up his motor when he pumps E70 thinking its E85? There can be many reasons for this to happen....mis labled, mis informed, or the pumps are all undergoing a transition period from Summer to Winter blend or vice versa.

Some of the Mustang and Supra guys who run fixed(no flex sensor) Ethanol maps test each and every tankful with a portable tester. Effective but tedious sounding.

Or can there be failsafes that can be programmed in for the very likely event that someday. somewhere the E85 that is pumped is no where near the percentage it is supposed to or believed to be?

The reason I am asking is that I think this is an awesome way to go for those of us that cant afford fancy new flex fuel systems or just want to stay with AEM for now.

There should be a minimum of 3 selectable tunes IMO:
1) Pump gas for those times when that is all that is available
2) E85 tune which should be for the average percentage available in your local area..likely 82% to 84% content.
3) E70 Even if you live in a warm state, its nice to be able to travel elsewhere and use sometimes the only ethanol available...E70

I loved the bumper cam. This is maybe the stealthiest HPF car out there..stock exhaust and not one tiny tell tale puff of black smoke/soot on acceleration. Well done!
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Old 04-05-2012, 07:06 PM   #7
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Chris, what happens if the owner ever runs out of E85 and cant find a station that sells it? I am assuming that this is NOT a flex fuel situation.

Also how does the owner keep from blowing up his motor when he pumps E70 thinking its E85? There can be many reasons for this to happen....mis labled, mis informed, or the pumps are all undergoing a transition period from Summer to Winter blend or vice versa.

Some of the Mustang and Supra guys who run fixed(no flex sensor) Ethanol maps test each and every tankful with a portable tester. Effective but tedious sounding.

Or can there be failsafes that can be programmed in for the very likely event that someday. somewhere the E85 that is pumped is no where near the percentage it is supposed to or believed to be?

The reason I am asking is that I think this is an awesome way to go for those of us that cant afford fancy new flex fuel systems or just want to stay with AEM for now.

There should be a minimum of 3 selectable tunes IMO:
1) Pump gas for those times when that is all that is available
2) E85
3) E70 Even if you live in a warm state, its nice to be able to travel elsewhere and use sometimes the only ethanol available...E70
I've has the same question.
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Old 04-05-2012, 07:32 PM   #8
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great stuff guys. Also interested in answers to bdaves questions
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You sir, just thread jacked the sh!t out of OP.
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Old 04-05-2012, 07:58 PM   #9
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Its a good idea if you can let your tuner KNOW what likely percentages of actual ethanol content you will encounter in your home town station(s). Try and choose stations that are consistent. Or take samples and have them tested.

Its hard not to want to think about getting one of these. I just found out about them. <600bux for the whole kit, sensor, in or on dash gauge read out. cool.

Yes, the kit below does include the sensor even though there is a note that it is not included. Ignore that notation. It is a disclaimer for when you just buy the gauge alone. They show a photo of the included 3 parts, the gauge, harness and sensor which is super easy to install in return line. A snap DIY.

https://partsforspeed.com/index.php?...roduct_id=4941

Here is a review on the E85 content gauge kit.
http://forums.evolutionm.net/alterna...iewed-ttp.html

Here is an excerpt from the above link:
Aside from slight variances in actual ethanol content, in many locations there is a "winter blend" major change in the content at E85 stations that take it down to the minimum 70%. They do this for improved cold start performance of the engine.

Problem is if you have been custom tuned to the edge of performance at 85% ethanol and all of a sudden got less ethanol and more gasoline, your car would no longer be tuned for the fuel content you had originally been set up to use.

On flex fuel N/A cars, these changes in content can be handled by the front O2 sensor which can adjust the fuel trims automatically. However on a high performance turbocharged engine like the 4g63 Evo at 35psi or so of boost pressure, a 15% change in alcohol content can have a serious impact on performance and octane level.

This is where the Zeitronix Ethanol Content Analyzer comes in handy.

There was a recent incident in N California where E85 was only E50. Such a difference can cause some serious engine damage on E85 tuned car. We also have seen E92 last summer when gas prices went through the roof. They added more E into E85.
E85 is a wonderful fuel, but you need to know what you get.
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Old 04-05-2012, 08:02 PM   #10
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One of the e85 only Evos around here has a lil tester, almost looks like a preg test lol, and it wasnt one time use, could use it over and over.
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Old 04-05-2012, 08:39 PM   #11
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Old 04-05-2012, 08:48 PM   #12
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Haha. Yes, i did see the "poor man's E85 tester". Not very practical IMO, but worth a mention, I suppose. I almost posted the link. I didn't. I will now.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/alterna...-analyzer.html

Read the whole thread. Its becomming apparant via MANY forums that single or dual stand alone E85 maps are becoming all the rage. There is no swath of blown engines because not everyone out there has ANY way of telling for sure what their ethanol percentage actually is.

Take for instance this guy:
"You are looking at it wrong, the Fairfield fuel is good and the Hayward fuel is crap. We want high levels of alcohol. Yes both are supposed to be E85

The Hayward fuel has way too much gasoline so it's something really low like only E50

in my STI It's been running like crap on the Hayward fuel, AFRs are at least a full point richer and the fuel trims have gone crazy tyring to compensate...car has felt very sluggish and idle is often unstable..."

I am surprised some serious damage was not done. Regardless of risk, I would feel MUCH better with the in-line sensor and gauge that constantly reads out Ethanol percentage, the Zeitronix ECA. Looks a sure winner.

Think of it. These guys are reaping the benefits of E85 with just a fuel map tune! Ok, so no awesome traction control, no auto flex fuel. I can live with that if all the hardware I need is a sub 600 dollar gauge. And most of the guys don't even have that!

If I look hard enough, I can find the thread where I talked in depth about this(did not know about the Zeitronix then). I was pretty much poo poo'd by the cliques at the time. Thats OK. But dont think now, you might be missing out on something tangible and real here? Its easily with in anyone grasp to run E85 with out 6.5k worth of equipment. Kevins Stage ONE dyno speaks for itself. No Pro EFI, no smoke and mirrors, just cool burning clean power...and a lot of it too.
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Old 04-05-2012, 08:53 PM   #13
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Finally it is done I was waiting for the results! Congrats Kevin!
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Old 04-06-2012, 05:26 AM   #14
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Nice one Chris Wish we had E85 in Bahrain
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Old 04-06-2012, 08:20 AM   #15
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Finally it is done I was waiting for the results! Congrats Kevin!
X2 - Just like Huy said, Congrats Brotha

Now go set up some runs between the 2 of you guys, in Mexico of course.
It should be very interesting to see the runs, as both you guys are running close in power.

Stage 1, e85 vs. Stage 2, Race + Meth
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Old 04-06-2012, 09:26 AM   #16
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X2 - Just like Huy said, Congrats Brotha

Now go set up some runs between the 2 of you guys, in Mexico of course.
It should be very interesting to see the runs, as both you guys are running close in power.

Stage 1, e85 vs. Stage 2, Race + Meth

Ohhh that sounds like a great idea! I'm up for it when I get her back. Should be back next week
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Old 04-06-2012, 11:22 AM   #17
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Old 04-06-2012, 12:07 PM   #18
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Not surprisingly, that's the best spooling curve you guys have posted yet! Nice!
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Old 04-06-2012, 12:32 PM   #19
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I wish someone would post about fail safes, actual number of selectable maps that were programmed in Kevin's car... ie provision for gas or E70?

Does anyone think that the fairly expensive Ethanol gauge (Zeitronix) is a good idea or totally unnecessary? I am quite curious as too your thoughts.

I predict more than a couple HPF owners doing this...going with an E85 tune with out a true flex system in place. Its been shown to be viable for years with some other FI cars.
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Old 04-06-2012, 01:03 PM   #20
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COngrats Kevin! I LOVED your first titanium silver HPF M3 and all the videos!

Great to see you back in a e46!

figured this is what youre missing now.
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